Really just a genuine question why would someone need hrt when non-binary? What would it do?

ha I mean it would do much the same thing as it would do to anyone else who took it

Well I kinda phrased it weird I meant as in which one would you get?

Oh I see! It would be testosterone in this case since I'm born female.

What does being bigender entail?

It's one possible form of being nonbinary. The gender binary says you are one or the other, so if one is YES then the other is NO, like a dependent choice market. But some people have the experience of NO to both or YES to both or maybe it changes sometimes (I would broadly classify those as agender, bigender, and gender fluid respectively).

So for me personally, it means there are aspects of both forms of gender expression that could resonate with me. For the last two years, though, I have not dressed in traditionally female-presenting clothing like dresses or skirts.

allow me to post questions some of which I could Google but amn't (and I'm fine being ignored)

1. What are the upsides for HRT?

For trans women I get the physical aspects, but I imagine those are less prudent for trans men, unless they'd want a beard...

2. How would you like a beard?

3. Do you have some ways of wearing it in mind?

I'm guessing the psychological aspect of how HRT influences you is big pull for most. I myself cannot imagine how different hormones would influence my being, therefore I cannot identify with the version of myself that experiences those hormones.

4. Is the psychological aspect of HRT a pull for you? Do you identify (more strongly) with the mind of the person under influence of HRT?

5. What does bigender mean?

The name makes me think you identify with the male and female gender, which then confused me as to why you're calling yourself a man.

6. What social shifts have you caused?

7. How did they make your world better (as I interpret you saying)?

8. does your friend group have (closeted) trans people in it aside from you?

Again, feel free to ignore any or all of my message. If just reading it was unpleasant, I hope you let me know in some way so I don't continue like this.

@Jono3h No problem.
1. A not too uncommon interaction for me in the shop is: the cashier will call me sir, then hear my voice and start to feel awkward and try to apologize. An upside of HRT would be the voice change, but a downside of HRT would be the voice change bc my soprano singing voice is lovely. I think a lot of gender is how we relate to other people. Other aspects would be some shifting of body weight, face shape etc.
2. and 3. it would be annoying if it were itchy, but I think it'd look great worn short or just with a little stubble. I have been growing my mustache but there's a limit to how much it'll do without hormones. Even with them I might not grow a lot of body hair, being part Asian. My dad's not a super hairy guy. So IDK
4. oof, I don't need any assistance with getting activated or confrontational and some people say that happens more on T. But others (eg Logan Strohl, iirc) have also said it can feel more clearheaded or more action-oriented in a way that I think complements my values. I would have to research more in detail about what the psychological effects would realistically be. I enjoy the current blend of self- and professionally-medicated chemicals in my brain so surely it'd be inconvenient to change that. But it could be ok in the long run.
5. Nonbinary is a bucket term for not fitting or ascribing to the gender binary, and there are different ways of being in that bucket. The gender binary says you are one or the other, so if one is YES then the other is NO, like a dependent choice market. That's the reason for your confusion. But some people clearly have the experience of NO to both or YES to both or maybe it changes sometimes. I wish I could change my form at will, go back and forth maybe, but that's super hard. I say man because that feels more true than woman, like when I see gender culture war bullshit I usually agree with the men.
6. Name in some contexts, gender designation on government ID, pronouns, appearance (hair and clothing)
7. Mostly social comfort. Also, feeling less focused on my appearance while having an easier time looking and feeling "put together."
8. I'm not closeted, but yeah a several of them are nonbinary and/or trans.

Betting no because I expect the waiting list to take longer than that. Granted, that's very location-dependent and assumes you're not planning to self-medicate.

@jesyspa oh gosh, I hadn't even thought of that part! makes sense.

I knew of someone in Ohio who was able to start relatively quickly. I'm in California.

@Clark It could be that things are better there, and if you're already in contact with medical professionals maybe there's faster paths. In the Netherlands, the official waiting time for the gender clinic that can do these things (after being referred by your GP) was 900 days when I signed up last June, and from what I've heard even that's an underestimate. Good luck, I hope whatever you end up doing it makes you happy. :)

Betting no since it sounds like you have a pretty reasonable understanding of what you want.

Additional questions I think could be useful:

1. How long has it been since you took whatever you think of as your most recent major transition step? (I feel like I sometimes wait for something to settle a bit, decide I'm still not satisfied with things, begin planning a new thing from my better baseline)

2. What does your friend group look like? Do you know other trans men who are on T or thinking about it?

3. Are there effects you view as downsides keeping you away from HRT or are you just not sure you want any of the effects enough to get access?

@tbrnichols Thanks for the thoughtful questions!

1. Hmm, a year and a half since changing the way I present with my appearance (hair and clothes). A few months since updating my gender designation on my ID, though that's probably not very meaningful to me since few will look at it. Still in the process of letting people know my chosen name- my partners started using it a year ago, but I'm not officially using it at work yet.

2. Day to day online friends: lots of gay and trans and neurodivergent furries. By contrast the IRL friend group that I grew up with is mostly cishet or cis/bisexual women, but they've accepted me with no issues. I dressed in a suit at one of their weddings. I had a neighbor who was on T but he moved away. Not many people in my personal life are on HRT. A couple of acquaintances / facebook friends are and they look fantastic!

3. Kinda both? I am a little uncomfortable with the idea of being unable to pass as my birth gender if I ever wanted to or needed to. Tbh my relation to gender is mostly that I care about what men like because I date men. The men I date are bisexual and haven't expressed being for or against medical transition. I guess a mental hurdle would be [mentally letting go of the possibility of being attractive to straight men] even though I don't date straight men.
As mentioned in my reply to Jono3h above, the voice change would be a pro AND a con. A lower speaking voice would make situations less socially confusing for others. But my current voice is a nice one, so it'd be a little bit of a loss too.

@Clark as an aside: I bet your partners are trying to be cognizant to not influence your journey. expressing a preference could be catastrophic!

@Stralor Ugh, that's why I had to get other ppl's mana involved 😂

@Clark oh we're in a similar boat haha. i'm not planning to try hormones (but i mostly date straight guys and the guy i expect to marry is straight), seems like voice training/working out/a wardrobe update would give me the flexibility i want (if i have the energy to follow through)

but given what you've said i could totally see you microdosing T or trying it to get those voice/body hair changes.

do you tend to be more novelty-seeking or risk-averse?

I've heard great things from transmen about their QoL after HRT. as I understand it, it's often less "urgent" for them relative to transwomen so they're more hesitant, but they're strongly confident in their choice after-the-fact and the benefits shouldn't be understated

@Stralor I imagine you're more tapped into the space than I am, however. is there anything about the process or outcomes that has you on the fence?